Unsolicited Engine Info Response

aquawilly54

Well Oiled
Sep 21, 2009
1,257
Willys Model
Willys Year:
Guys, this is a response I posted this morning back on page 4 I think. For some reason, I feel it necessary to reiterate, so that all will read. I've seen a lot of discussion on different engine installations which can be cause for a variety of concerns, from small diesels and all the fabrication that goes with it, to monster V-8's and the issues that creep up there. I am by no means a professional car restorer. A lot of you guys have far more experience than I, but I have seen some serious hack jobs on these poor ol' Willys and most of it comes from an engine install gone bad, all in the name of more power. With that said, here is what I wrote.

Generally, any V8 you install is going to require firewall modification, and more than likely cutting a notch out of the front crossmember. V6's fit much better. The main thing to consider is heat. A V6 leaves more room for under hood heat to escape. V8's get pretty warm under there. You have to look at the fire wall. In most cars designed with V8's, the firewall will go down about a third of the way and then slope back pretty good. This allows for scavenging of the under hood heat. The Willys firewall does not do this and therefore tends to keep that heat in. I have run ford V8's in a few different Willys trucks and Wagons. All required firewall and crossmember mods (not a huge deal, but still...) and all created some serious heat at the floor board. A good radiator helps a lot as far as engine temps, but it still warms up that cab. Let's talk radiators. Just because one installs a huge radiator that spans from headlight to headlight does not mean efficient cooling. The idea here (for a V8) is to use a 3 or 4 core radiator, but it still needs to fit properly in the grille space so ALL of the air gets pushed through the whole radiator. Also, if you don't "seal" the sides a lot of that cool air goes around the radiator instead of through it, so seal it on the sides and use a good shroud on the engine side. That said, why not go with a V-6? You can still get plenty of power if done right. Why would you want to modify (usually means a BFH) the firewall if you don't have to? Been there, done that. I once was young and stupid. Now i'm old and well...depends on how the spouse mouse is feeling.
Good luck and have fun, but no matter which way you go... do it right.
Steve
 
Great point most people would never think of the firewall which like you say is one of the most important parts along with all the other (LITTLE) stuff, thanks for sharing. my 62 pickup has a sbc (350) in it but it was like that when I got it when the engine wears out (gitting close) I will prob go will a v-6 for all the reasons you said. Although it doesnt run hot it also was installed right besides the elec. fan I put a reg. fan on and a shroud which helps alot. so anybody doing this good luck I would just stay with stock engines for the old Willys and enjoy.
 
I agree completely.... Everyone told me to ditch my Stock Motor for a V8....Half of those same people are now telling me how cool it is! Yea, it's slow as dirt, but it's definatley cool! and nothing beats pulling a new V8 Chevy out with a 1954 straight 6! :lol:
 
nothing beats pulling a new V8 Chevy out with a 1954 straight 6!

Now that's funny. :thumbup:
 
Hey Aquawilly

I have to add my 2 cents to this writing you started. I know I am kinda old and probably set in my ways but I have never had a V8 engine. I have a total of 10 years of racing under my belt and never owned a V8. I believe the 4 cylinders and the 6 cylinders have more than enough get up and go. As far as street cars go....same deal..I dont know how you guys can even work on those big motors...I had a V6 once in a S10 truck and didnt know where to start to work on it. I mean you stand on one side of the vehicle and go around to the other side of the vehicle and it looks the same. With the inline stuff each side of the motor looks different. Kinda keeps me grounded. I know which side I am on. How te heck do you change spark plugs in a V8 anyways??? Can you even see the plugs???...
Just my twisted way of looking at things...
 
I am all for the inl 6s and 4s I came across a low mileage Ford 302 for free from a friend. That made my decision for me am I going to run into problems or is this just an observation of poor workmanship from mediocre mechanics? If I pay attention to the details will it work or am I setting myself up for failure? :?:
 
You can get anything to work....it's just of what the whole process entails and how will it turn out when it's all said and done. I believe one of the main challenges doing an engine swap is the distance between the engine and the shift levers on the trans. On most setups this distance is to closer together than the stock, so the engine ends up hitting the fire wall, and you have to hack. If I was going to do a re-power, I would look at the doing a high output 6 from some of the newer jeeps or something similar. But I have not looked into it far enough yet. The one problem I see with going with the newer high output 6 is I don't think it bolts up to my transfercase and I would also loose my overdrive. To me, those things give my truck a certian feel and level of performance that I am not willing to part with.
 
Hurricane226 said:
You can get anything to work....it's just of what the whole process entails and how will it turn out when it's all said and done. I believe one of the main challenges doing an engine swap is the distance between the engine and the shift levers on the trans. On most setups this distance is to closer together than the stock, so the engine ends up hitting the fire wall, and you have to hack. If I was going to do a re-power, I would look at the doing a high output 6 from some of the newer jeeps or something similar. But I have not looked into it far enough yet. The one problem I see with going with the newer high output 6 is I don't think it bolts up to my transfercase and I would also loose my overdrive. To me, those things give my truck a certain feel and level of performance that I am not willing to part with.
I agree I am keeping my t90 AND SPICER 18 with warn overdrive. The 302 I am putting in will be for reliable power stock intake and exhaust. I already lost the original motor prior to my purchase dont want to loose the original drivetrain.
 
Anything other than original ,it will take fabrication and adaptation there is no way around it and if not done correctly can be a nightmare, There are adapters made that can put about any engine to whatever transmission and/or Transfer case made, They can be expensive to purchase and difficult to make.+ Attention needs to be paid to the entire driveline, a modern V8 can easily over power a T90 and leave you with 3rd and reverse (first hand knowledge) the dana 18 can handle more. There is nothing wrong with staying with a stock drivetrain or going with repower ,one just needs to be aware of the the challenge and thier capability to accomplish the task . This is not a new game When I got the 51 truck (now part 55) It had a 283 Chev that had been put in in 59, the V8 swap is common with both Ford and Chevy. After doing a few V8s The 4.3 V6 would be easy. the 4.0 Jeep would be a good choice but would take some parts research.
 
Alright, I am gonna chime in with this. I did purchase mine with a Ford V-8 installed. I never got to drive it more than 30 feet. (no brakes when I bought it) At this point I did correct the shotty firewall mods done by the previous owner. I still have some finishing work to do. But I will say that with my experience with newer Jeeps, a V-8 in a small engine compartment does cause some heat, but the right radiator, fan, and exhaust set up go a long way. I wish I still had the straight six it came with, but I'll take what I got an make the best I can of it.

My 2 cents

Eric
 
OK throwing in my two cents. I am keeping a 226 in mine. It was originally a four banger truck but no drive train. I have however made it my mission in life to get the old edmunds parts for the truck and use evey other trick I can think of to pull more out of it. I'm also looking at putting in the t98 four speed. I am not against engine swaps and feel that if you want a v8 thas your call and time and effort to do. I have looked at putting an 8 in the wifes wagon when I get to build it as the truck comes first. If I do decide to put a v8 in it it would have to be an old ford flathead though.
Just my two cents.
 
Took the Jeepster on the freeway today, 50 to 65 mph all day long. Topped it out at 72 on the GPS. No overdrive (but I wish I had one) and the T90/t18 were amazingly whine free. That's what the 265 SB V8 does for me. It heats up but nothing a thick layer of dynamat can't handle. The firewall fabrication is the trickiest part, the adapters and mounting brackets are pretty available online. Don't forget the gearing, mine runs 4:27 so I'm lucky. 5:38 is tough on the highway. And finally you want to engineer your radiator choices carefully to get the most volume out of the nine slats.

It all comes down to the basic question: what you gonna use the rig for? Low torque is great once you get to the hills but getting there may take all day. These old horses wern't built to race either so stick with a short block engine for sure, you'll roast like a turkey on a hot summer if your tempted to drop a 350 in there.

good luck, this is a great post.
 
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