Timken Clamshel rearend, rear Hubs, & Pullers -'48 pickup

Vintage Don

Well Oiled
Oct 9, 2017
3,855
Medina, Ohio
First Name
Don
Willys Model
  1. Pickup
Willys Year:
  1. 1948
Yep, I'm ever so slowly moving toward those areas..... which is kind of appropriate, since Halloween is just around the corner - and those are kinda scary places! haha

Like usual, it's a long, roundabout path with me in getting there. I know I talked a lot recently about the big "Turnaround Day" event and getting ready with the truck now backwards on the Lift to be able to work on the rear half this winter. But lots of side jobs along the way.... After Hershey last week, I'm trying hard to finish up a bunch of half-completed things that I should get out of the way to "clear the decks" and start the rear end work.

There is still the "Stuck Stat and Muddy Water" issue to complete, flushing the cooling system. And I had to finish up and re-install the old original oil filter I found recently, and that's in place on there now. I decided I needed to put wheels on the Engine Run Stand, so I could more easily roll the engine around, get it outside for more flushing before I install the thermostat and antifreeze. Putting casters on that took up one morning, but worth it - it was too much hassle moving it around without wheels.

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And not so long ago, I sandblasted the seat frames and got them in primer. I still want to sand them down and get paint on them (outside) while I still have good weather for painting. Someday (I remain optimistic!) the upholstery dude will actually call me and say he has the seat cushions ready! He's "only" had them since May... but I figured that's how it would go, which is why I took them to him a long time ago.

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So while at Hershey, I was looking for Hub Pullers - fully expecting to have a struggle, getting the old rear hubs off when I got to that point. And I finally found the highly prized OTC Puller, but it only had 2 legs with it. Which made it practically free (guys were asking $100 and more for these! I got this one for $10), so I bought it, realizing from earlier research about these that I could pick up extra legs if need be. (Learned that with Google and studying about these Pullers on the phone in the motel room in the evenings..) So my buddy at the local auto parts got the 3rd leg ordered for me ($35).

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But I also found another very antique looking puller that looked promising. Not as large as the OTC, but for $10 I bought it too. Well used.

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And I decided just for the heck of it, I would try it out on the rear hub, and see if I could get lucky. So it fit up reasonably well, and I mounted it up on the hub. And then I remembered the part about everything is going to want to turn, since there's no driveshaft (or engine! ha) so I stuck a crowbar through something and wedged it to stop the diff from turning.

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This old one is not made for using a hammer to turn it (I was looking forward to that part with the OTC puller!), but a big wrench and some muscle power, and would you believe, in short order there was a solid "pop", and damned if that hub didn't come right off! So I went over to the other side and did it again.

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Talk about scary places - inside that hub hadn't seen the light of day for, well - a really, really long time. The truck had been "parked" (to be polite) since 1962, we know that.

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But of course, 5 minutes with a little wire brush and a rag, and it began to look like auto parts again. It was mostly just about Oklahoma spiders colonizing things in there.

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Today, I had other things that used up most of my day - but I got started sandblasting the hubs in the cabinet this evening, hopefully to find that we can turn them and re-use them. I'm Old School enough that I will replace the 2 broken off studs on this side with new Left Hand studs I have already bought (I know, I know - if I was smart I would replace all of them with Right Hand studs. And replace the drums too - but I'm not smart, just stubborn).

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And of course the missing 3rd leg for the big OTC Puller came in today, too. So now that's complete and useable - and now not needed, at least not at present. But I'm glad to have it in the toolbox, and it was an adventure getting it all together and a bargain. That's the new leg on the left side.

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So this might end up being a l-o-n-g string, as I finally get to work on the dreaded Timken Clamshell rear end in the coming weeks..... stay tuned!
 
I replaced a couple broken lefty studs on mine, too. I like the provenance of the left hand studs, some sort of badge of honor. I would drill the head off the stud from inside (they are surprisingly soft), like I did. Then drive them out from the inside. Otherwise, you have to have a swage cutter to cut off the swaging to drive out from the front. DO NOT just press is out, you WILL crack the hub and make a new paper weight.
 
Right, gotta watch that swage lip for sure. I had to do one of them on the front, earlier, so I've got this -

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I like your idea of drilling from inside, too. Might experiment with that.

But now that I've cleaned these up - boy oh boy - we've got some DEEP pitting, and lots of it. I'm thinking I should probably get some replacement drums. I suppose I could turn these and just see how they clean up, but not very encouraging looking. Here's the worst area, highlighting the pits with a flashlight.

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Problem is, these are 11" (not the more common 9"), and they have the "double skirt" edge, that encloses the outer lip of the backing plate, like this -

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I don't know if that actually matters. Most all the replacements only have the inner skirt, and the outer lip (where it would be if it had one) just kind of stops and meets the backing plate edge. Like this -

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Of course, if I change drums, I'll also be drilling out all 10 studs, too. Ugh.
 
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Don,don't want to derail your thread,but is your swage cutter just a carbide tipped hole saw attachment or is it "job specific", meant to cut the material around wheel studs? I may need to have this further down the road. Also what is the diameter? Thanks
 
Here's everything I know, in 3 photos. My car guy friend at the local auto parts actually owns it and has lent it until we're through this phase, but said it is what I need, and that he has used it before for this purpose. He's not just a vendor, but truly a friend - helped extensively with the floor pan replacement, etc. The 11/16" fits just right.

I see them on Amazon for about $15.

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I must admit I’m out of touch with the swage issue. I don’t know what “swage” is. Most, if not all, studs I have removed or installed over the years drive/press out from the front and new ones are driven/pulled/pressed in from the back. With splines to prevent rotation. Before I heard about swage, yesterday I ground off the stud heads (from inside the drum) and then with a large punch drove out the rest of the stud (again from inside the drum). Did I cause harm to the drum and hub?
 
On old rigs like willys they would swell the outside lip of the stud after it was pressed into the flange like a rivet. If you would try to press it out ,you would destroy the hole and bend the flange. So you need to remove the swelled head, the holesaw is a great way, I have ground the lip off or drilled the old stud to weaken it before the pressing...... as far as causing damage if the hole is tight to the stud and the flange is straight... no ...just dumb luck...Phil
 
On old rigs like willys they would swell the outside lip of the stud after it was pressed into the flange like a rivet. If you would try to press it out ,you would destroy the hole and bend the flange. So you need to remove the swelled head, the holesaw is a great way, I have ground the lip off or drilled the old stud to weaken it before the pressing...... as far as causing damage if the hole is tight to the stud and the flange is straight... no ...just dumb luck...Phil
Thanks. I understand swage a whole lot better..
 
When you use the 3 jaw puller you absolutely do not hammer hard on the butterfly. you tighten the butterfly and slam the big middle pin with a BFH. Some clown has a Youtube video showing how you should bang hard on the butterfly to loosen the hub. That breaks the hub puller. (strips the threads). Do not do it his way. He knows not what he is doing. And keep the threads oiled up also.
diggerG
 
Don,
I’m with Phil on driving them out from the inside. I realize you have sourced a Swage cutter of sorts (actually a hole saw) but when you use that, no matter how delicate your touch, you will be removing material from the front side of the drum. Once you have a stud out by whatever means, you will see that the front of the drum was actually chamfered. Your Swage cutter will cut a flat bottomed hole and thus remove some of the original drum material from the front side of the drum. As Phil pointed out, the head of the stud is very soft material and it is easy to grind, or in my case, drill. Using a 5/8” bit in a drill press, you can easily remove the mushroomed portion to the stud from the inside of the drum, and then supporting the front side on the drum on a junk socket or the like, use a big punch (like 3/8”) and they easily drive out to the front side of the drum.
Here's everything I know, in 3 photos. My car guy friend at the local auto parts actually owns it and has lent it until we're through this phase, but said it is what I need, and that he has used it before for this purpose. He's not just a vendor, but truly a friend - helped extensively with the floor pan replacement, etc. The 11/16" fits just right.

I see them on Amazon for about $15.

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Don, from what I can see, those don’t look like swaged studs. That hub looks like the press-fit type.

Heaven knows I could be wrong, but my swaged drum looked more like the one in this picture. I think. It's been awhile.
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/fixing-the-front-wheel-hub.357372/#post-1971356832

Edit: looking at the picture in post #4, the lugs do look like they may be swaged, but the one with your hole saw bit perched over it in the post below doesn't. Well, it won't hurt to cut one down a little and see.
 
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Right, thanks. I have been told in the past that the rears (which these are) were NOT swaged in, but the fronts are. But to my eye, they look the same....

I think I will probably cut into the swage a little, as you say. And then, drill it from behind, too. My fear is, I have to hit it EXACTLY in the center if I drill - or else I'm going to eat into where I don't want to be. Was thinking I might go in with just a 1/2" bit from inside, and cut the swage area just shallow, and then study what I see before I whack it. (And then I'll probably decide the pits are just too deep to use the drum, won't clean up well enough - and end up starting all over with another one if I can manage to find one........)
 
Right, thanks. I have been told in the past that the rears (which these are) were NOT swaged in, but the fronts are. But to my eye, they look the same....

I think I will probably cut into the swage a little, as you say. And then, drill it from behind, too. My fear is, I have to hit it EXACTLY in the center if I drill - or else I'm going to eat into where I don't want to be. Was thinking I might go in with just a 1/2" bit from inside, and cut the swage area just shallow, and then study what I see before I whack it. (And then I'll probably decide the pits are just too deep to use the drum, won't clean up well enough - and end up starting all over with another one if I can manage to find one........)
Don,
The issue of getting the hole started exactly in the center (looking at the inside of the drum) bedeviled me as well. As I recall, the manufacturer of the stud had some raised lettering on the back side. So I ground that off first before trying to accurately center punch the stud. I did used a smaller drill initially to creat a pilot hole and also to give me a good visual on whether I was actually on center. I then stepped up in size(s) until I got to 5/8”, the nominal diameter of the knurled part of the stud. They were all close enough that at that point, the punch (3/8” dia) got them out w/ just a few blows from a 3 pounder. Carry on!
 
I just center punched the stud head on the inside, drilled it deep with a 1/2 bit, and sheared the head off with a chisel. Then the stud will drive out from the inside towards the drum face. Takes less than 10 minutes for the whole process, with a quality drill bit. Those studs are definitely swaged, mine were on my early 1950 (flat grille) pickup Timken.
 
Back on track for the past couple of days. There were those side topics about gas tanks, and then seats, taking up time but both of which seem to be resolving now. Agne2520 has very generously shipped me his gas tank, it's on it's way via Fastenal. Again many, many thanks to him for that, I am indebted. And I have a developing plan to pick up a correct seat cushion from Wunderwillys some time next week - another problem solved, thanks to the OldWillysForum! How cool is that.

So yesterday afternoon, I started pulling things apart in earnest, finally. Things have been soaking in penetrating Sea-Foam for a week or so. First I had to re-jack up the rear of the truck and brace things good - it'll be sitting in this position for quite a while now, lots to do. Had to support it by the frame now, instead of by the rear axle. Started with all the brackets that hold the parking brake cables in place - the ones attaching to the spring clamp clips were especially fun. Then got the big U-bolts off the axle, and then the rear shocks and springs off (those are HEAVIER than they used to be...) after much conversation with all the cotter pins. I know, I should just start out by cutting all the old stuff off. But I just can't get myself to do it that way - I have to get the cotter pins out, and unscrew the castle nuts, and so forth. It feels like such a victory to get it to disassemble like it's supposed to. And after 70 years - 55 of which was just being "parked" (we don't say "junked") - it's a real enough challenge.

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This morning was the heavy lifting. Got the axle down out of there. Those are heavier than they used to be, too! I found this out trying to get it up on the horses.

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At one point it was tipped forward for a while, and I was very glad to see that some grease leaked out where the pinion seal is (well, used to be). A good sign! None was showing looking in the fill hole, but things were still juicy looking inside at least.

And then I stripped everything I could off the axle. Brakes came apart easily enough (only drew blood once), and again - much to my surprise - there was still brake fluid in the lines. Didn't expect that. The fronts were bone dry - the front brake lines were rusted through.

Backing plates etc came right off. Lots of new shims showed up, the passenger side had a ton, none on the drivers side. In fact, it looks like a second spacer on this side, only one on the other side. Not sure what any of that might mean yet....

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So tomorrow a friend is coming over and we are going to turn the brake drums and find out if they are re-usable. That's why I haven't done the broken stud replacement yet - let's see how they look. If they're usable, then I'll replace those two broken studs.

So now the old truck is down to the bare frame behind the cab... nothing left to take off.

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and I've got piles of gnarly, greasy parts to clean up (again!). I may work on that the next day or two, getting the fasteners and all the bits and pieces cleaned up and sorted and organized.

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Meanwhile, that rear end turns real nice and silky smooth. The outer wheel bearings are clunky, but the diff itself is silent..... I could be talked into leaving it alone inside.....
 
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I must say the disassembly of my ‘49 SW has gone unexpectedly well. Most bolts and screws readily unthreaded - only a very few sheared off. Once I got a proper hub puller, the rear hubs/drums came off easily. All the brake hardware is intact and easily reusable. Even the flare nuts and the bleeder screws came out!! That would never happen if my truck had spent its life in Nova Scotia rather than in Colorado. Body and frame are now separated and the project continues!!
 
What was the history of this truck, Don?

Was it sitting a long time? If so, where? In what kind of climate?

If it was in a sheltered place or in a dry climate, I’d be more inclined to take the chance and try running it without a rebuild. On the other hand, if it was in a humid climate, I’d be more worried that bearing and contact surfaces above the oil line may have rusted.

These have a good reputation, so it’s not likely worn out unless someone put a lot of miles on your truck, which would have been unusual. These were mostly used for local needs, so very few of them racked up enough miles to wear out a rear end. It’s more the exposure to the elements that is the concern.
 
Hi, Lookout -

The truck was in service from 1948 until 1962, all in central Oklahoma, and then put out to pasture - pretty much literally. It has 72,000 miles on it.

I bought it from the family of the man (the second owner - Ira Stinson) who drove it from his purchase in 1955 until he "parked it" in 1962. He tagged it through 1960 (I have all his registrations), then he used it 2 more years, apparently not (not legally, anyway) on the road. During Ira's 7 years of use, it was reportedly all local - on his ranch land, and his odd jobs - per his surviving son. The first owner has been lost to history, but Ira bought it second hand in his small town in Oklahoma, that much we know. I have the Title from when he got it. And the license plates from 1956 to 1960 were still on it - each one wired on, on top of the one from previous year!

It is amazingly original - from the Potomac Gray paint (what's left of it), down to the 1948 Autolite ignition coil, engine and drive train, generator, starter, distributor, etc, etc. All date coded 1948.

Having said all that - it apparently got used pretty hard toward the end. Broken front engine mount plate had allowed the engine to sag over, broken front left spring (possibly after it was parked, who knows), broken left front axle. That happened when still being driven because he made some "adjustments" to fall back to 2 wheel drive use only (soup can instead of a hub...).

It was real, real dried out. And rusted on all horizontal surfaces - basically the cab floor and bed floor were swiss cheese. All rubber components rotted away. 55 years is a l-o-n-g time to sit in the weather, even in Oklahoma.... yet the vertical surfaces are very solid, the frame is perfect. And I have been successful in unbolting most fasteners, that kind of thing. Some of course are rusted to lumps of iron oxide and brittle. Yet it still had grease and oil inside each component. The engine was stuck, but that probably happened from sitting. I got it freed up it fairly easily, before I pulled it out and rebuilt it. The internal components were pretty tired, though. Bored 30 over, 20 under on the crank. Runs like new now.

And since the Timken clamshell rear diff is what it is, to actually SEE how it looks you have to split it open - no cover to pull off and have a look!

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